Moderador: Arkantos
En 1945 a raíz de las pruebas con el XF 5-U, ya se habló de platillos volantes y a partir de que la prensa habló de eso, este modelo desapareció.
Te he dicho mil veces que dejes esa horrible costumbre de MENTIR. Por favor, ese tipo de afirmaciones fundamentalas con referencias validas, sino volveras a caer en la categoría de MENTIROSA, EMBUSTERA, y todo lo demás.
“En 1946 el XF 5-U fue finalmente mostrado al público. Inmediatamente, comenzaron a aparecer historias de prensa en que se decía que los extraños aviones XF 5_U eran nada más que un forma de encubrir un proyecto militar TOP SECRET acerca de platillos voladores”
liria_azaila escribió:Bueno, el video no es del tema Ovni, si no de aviación.
Es de History Channel y trata de la historia del XF 5 U. No trata de ovnis, ni nada similar.
liria_azaila escribió:En 1945 a raíz de las pruebas con el XF 5-U, ya se habló de platillos volantes y a partir de que la prensa habló de eso, este modelo desapareció.
Te traje las referencias. ¿No te tendré que traer también las niotas de prensa? ¿Verdad?
No se hablaba en 1946 de "platillos volantes" exactamente, si no de naves redondas o aviones disco.
El termino "platillo" fué de Bequette, ( pensaría en algo de comer, tendría hambre cuando hablaba con Arnold )
“En 1946 el XF 5-U fue finalmente mostrado al público. Inmediatamente, comenzaron a aparecer historias de prensa en que se decía que los extraños aviones XF 5_U eran nada más que un forma de encubrir un proyecto militar TOP SECRET acerca de platillos voladores”
Interpretalo como quieras, pero con Zimmerman danzando por ahí...
Ok, de acuerdo con que no hablan de OVNis directamente, pero sin duda la intencionalidad es hacer aparecer como que en realidad los OVNIs eran de manufactura nortemaricana.
hacer creer que ya en 1943 los V173-Flying Flapjack eran causantes de avistamientos OVNI,
Hacer creer que XF-5U (aparentemente el sucesor del V173), era una excusa para encubrir verdaderos proyectos secretos de construcción de "flying saucers".
A ver liria, por favor explícame..¿Por qué endemoniada razón, el solo hecho de que la prensa haya hablado de eso, tendría que significar que el modelo haya tenido que desaparecer? (el video dice que el modelo se hizo publico en 1945 y desapareció luego)
Bien, ¿Y cual era el termino que usaba Shauberger?
La unica interpretación que eso tiene, es que los militares norteamericanos quieren hacerte creer que los platillos voladores son proyectos secretos militares. Pasó con los debunkeos de Ramey para el caso Roswell, en el que mostraba publicamente globos atmosfericos, pasó con el disco AVRO al que los propios militares le hacian propaganda durante años, pasó en 1990 cuando la USAF intentó hacer creer que lo de Roswell era un tren Mogul, y sigue pasando en este video...
Entonces ¿Porqué los militares hablan de platillos de procedencia desconocida, de persecuciones a ovnis mediante aviones de combate y de que no representan un peligro para la seguridad nacional (de los EE.UU)?
Lo fué, mientras se probó y los que lo veían no lo conocían. Para ellos era un ovni. Para tí un ovni forzosamente es extraterrestre, para los demás es algo sin identificar.
Los militares son extraños, a veces quieren ocultar un fusil, diciendo que tienen una ametralladora laser...
Piensan que mientras busquen el laser no encontraran el fusil.
Otros sin embargo si diseñaron naves discoidales y les pusieron nombres como "Omega Diskus" de Andreas Epp.
Los militares nunca han hablado jamas de proyectos secretos. Solo cuando han presentado al público un aparato, este ha empezado a existir.
Si lo que quieren hacer creer es que los platillos voladores son proyectos secretos militares, se les dá muy bien, ya que jamas se ha visto tan chapuceras naves para venir de otro planeta. (Salvo cuando declaran perseguir con sus aviones a ovnis)
Si comparamos las estadisticas y comparamos naves aliens contra ascensores, vemos que casi el ascensor es más seguro que las naves extraterrestres. Al menos con muy pocos accidentes...
liria_azaila escribió:Ok, de acuerdo con que no hablan de OVNis directamente, pero sin duda la intencionalidad es hacer aparecer como que en realidad los OVNIs eran de manufactura nortemaricana.
Entonces ¿Porqué los militares hablan de platillos de procedencia desconocida, de persecuciones a ovnis mediante aviones de combate y de que no representan un peligro para la seguridad nacional (de los EE.UU)?
hacer creer que ya en 1943 los V173-Flying Flapjack eran causantes de avistamientos OVNI,
Lo fué, mientras se probó y los que lo veían no lo conocían. Para ellos era un ovni. Para tí un ovni forzosamente es extraterrestre, para los demás es algo sin identificar.
Hacer creer que XF-5U (aparentemente el sucesor del V173), era una excusa para encubrir verdaderos proyectos secretos de construcción de "flying saucers".
La verdad es que es un poco absurdo, pero también usan la historia extraterrestre para encubrirlo.
Los militares son extraños, a veces quieren ocultar un fusil, diciendo que tienen una ametralladora laser...
Piensan que mientras busquen el laser no encontraran el fusil.
A ver liria, por favor explícame..¿Por qué endemoniada razón, el solo hecho de que la prensa haya hablado de eso, tendría que significar que el modelo haya tenido que desaparecer? (el video dice que el modelo se hizo publico en 1945 y desapareció luego)
Los militares se excusaron con que llevaba helices y estaba atrasado con respecto a los reactores, pero hasta la llegada del Harrier anglocanadiense, la US NAVY no tuvo un avión de despege corto o casi vertical, ni a helices ni a reactores, exceptuando los helicópteros a hélices.
Y coincidió la publicación en la prensa, con su apresurada retirada.
Bien, ¿Y cual era el termino que usaba Shauberger?
Otros sin embargo si diseñaron naves discoidales y les pusieron nombres como "Omega Diskus" de Andreas Epp.
Los militares nunca han hablado jamas de proyectos secretos. Solo cuando han presentado al público un aparato, este ha empezado a existir.
Les sale más barato hablar de extraterrestres, ya que hay una banda detras haciendoles el trabajo gratis.
Si comparamos las estadisticas y comparamos naves aliens contra ascensores, vemos que casi el ascensor es más seguro que las naves extraterrestres. Al menos con muy pocos accidentes...
Dogon shame
Did ancient gods from the Sirius star system visit an African tribe 5,000 years ago? New evidence deals a devastating blow to what was considered to be the best case for extraterrestrial visitation.
Philip Coppens
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The story that the Dogon, a tribe in Mali, West Africa, had possessed in their antiquity extraordinary knowledge of the star system Sirius achieved worldwide publicity in 1976 through Robert Temple’s extraordinary book The Sirius Mystery. It was compellingly argued and became one of the most influential books of the 1970s ‘ancient astronauts’ genre.
Sirius is the brightest star in the sky, a star that became the marker of an important ancient Egyptian calendar, and a star that is said to be at the centre of beliefs held by the Freemasons. According to some cultures, Sirius is where the forefathers of the human race might have originated.
Temple claimed that the Dogon knew about two smaller stars that are closely related to Sirius – Sirius B and Sirius C. The mystery was how they had obtained this knowledge, as these companion stars cannot be seen by the unaided eye. Temple’s solution referred to legends of a mythical creature, the god Oannes, who might have been an extraterrestrial, described as descending to Earth from the stars to bring civilising wisdom to the Dogon forefathers.
In 1998, Temple republished the book with the subtitle “new scientific evidence of alien contact 5,000 years ago.” The book’s reputation was first dented in 1999, when Lynn Picknett and Clive Prince published The Stargate Conspiracy, in which they allege that Temple’s thinking had been heavily influenced by his mentor, Arthur M. Young. Young was a fervent believer in “the Council of Nine,” a mysterious group of channelled entities that claim to be the nine creator gods of ancient Egypt. ‘The Nine’ became part of the UFO and New Age mythology and many claim to be in contact with them. ‘The Nine’ also claim to be extraterrestrial beings from the star Sirius. In 1952, Young was one of nine people present during the “first contact” with the ‘Council’, an event initiated by Andrija Puharich, the man who brought Israeli spoonbender Uri Geller to America. [Puharich, a fellow of the SRI (Stanford Research Institute, a company with well-documented ties to intel ops - arc-us]
In 1965, Arthur Young gave Robert Temple a French article on the secret star lore of the Dogon, an article written by two French anthropologists Marcel Griaule and Germaine Dieterlen. In 1966, Temple – then aged 21 – became Secretary of Young’s Foundation for the Study of Consciousness. In 1967, Temple began work on the thesis that became The Sirius Mystery. As Picknett and Prince have been able to show, Temple’s arguments are often based on erroneous readings of encyclopædia entries and misrepresentations of ancient Egyptian mythology. They conclude that Temple was very keen to please his mentor, who believed in extraterrestrial beings from Sirius.
Though Temple’s work was challenged, at its core lay the original anthropological study of the Dogon by Griaule and Dieterlen, who describe the secret knowledge of Sirius B and Sirius C in their own book The Pale Fox. But now, in another recent publication – Ancient Mysteries by Peter James and Nick Thorpe – this “mystery” is also uncloaked as a hoax or a lie perpetrated by Griaule.
To recapitulate: Griaule claimed to have been initiated into the secret mysteries of the male Dogon, during which they allegedly told him of Sirius (sigu tolo in their language) and its two invisible companions. In the 1930s, when their research was carried out, Sirius B was known to have existed, even though it was only photographed in 1970. It was very unlikely that the Dogon had learned of this star’s existence from Westerners prior to the visit by Griaule and Dieterlen.
Griaule and Dieterlen first described their findings in an article published in French in 1950, but they included no comment about how extraordinary the Dogon knowledge of the ‘invisible companions’ was. This step was taken by others, particularly Temple, in the Sixties and Seventies. To quote Ancient Mysteries: “While Temple, following Griaule, assumes that to polo is the invisible star Sirius B, the Dogon themselves, as reported by Griaule, say something quite different.” To quote the Dogon: “When Digitaria (to polo) is close to Sirius, the latter becomes brighter; when it is at its most distant from Sirius, Digitaria gives off a twinkling effect, suggesting several stars to the observer.” This description of a very visible effect causes James and Thorpe to wonder – as anyone reading this should do – whether to polo is therefore an ordinary star near Sirius, not an invisible companion, as Griaule and Temple suggest.
The biggest challenge to Griaule, however, came from anthropologist Walter Van Beek. He points out that Griaule and Dieterlen stand alone in their claims about the Dogon secret knowledge. No other anthropologist supports their opinions. In 1991, Van Beek led a team of anthropologists to Mali and declared that they found absolutely no trace of the detailed Sirius lore reported by the French anthropologists. James and Thorpe understate the problem when they say “this is very worrying.” Griaule claimed that about 15 per cent of the Dogon tribe possessed this secret knowledge, but Van Beek could find no trace of it in the decade he spent with the Dogon. Van Beek actually spoke to some of Griaule’s original informants; he noted that “though they do speak about sigu tolo [interpreted by Griaule as their name for Sirius itself], they disagree completely with each other as to which star is meant; for some, it is an invisible star that should rise to announce the sigu [festival], for another it is Venus that, through a different position, appears as sigu tolo. All agree, however, that they learned about the star from Griaule.” Van Beek states that this creates a major problem for Griaule’s claims.
Although he was an anthropologist, Griaule was keenly interested in astronomy and had studied it in Paris. As James and Thorpe point out, he took star maps along with him on his field trips as a way of prompting his informants to divulge their knowledge of the stars. Griaule himself was aware of the discovery of Sirius B and in the 1920s – before he visited the Dogon – there were also unconfirmed sightings of Sirius C.
The Dogon were well aware of the brightest star in the sky but, as Van Beek learned, they do not call it sigu tolo, as Griaule claimed, but dana tolo. To quote James and Thorpe: “As for Sirius B, only Griaule’s informants had ever heard of it.” Was Griaule told by his informants what he wanted to believe; did he misinterpret the Dogon responses to his questions? Either way, the original purity of the Dogon-Sirius story is itself a myth as it is highly likely that Griaule contaminated their knowledge with his own.
With this, the Dogon mystery comes crashing down. For more then 20 years, The Sirius Mystery has influenced speculation about the possibility that our ‘forefathers’ came from the stars. In his 1998 revised edition, Temple was quick to point out the new discussions in scientific circles about the possible existence of Sirius C, which seemed to make Griaule’s claims even more spectacular and accurate. But it is apparent that Temple was not aware of Van Beek’s devastating research.
From the findings of Van Beek and the authors of Ancient Mysteries, it is clear that Griaule himself was responsible for the creation of a modern myth; one which, in retrospect, has created such an industry and near-religious belief that the scope and intensity of it can hardly be fathomed. Nigel Appleby – whose book Hall of the Gods was withdrawn from publication – has admitted to being tremendously influenced by Temple’s Sirius Mystery. He has written of Temple’s belief that present-day authorities are unwilling to set aside the blinkers of orthodoxy, unable to admit the validity of anything that lies outside their field or that offers a challenge to the status quo. Appleby also believes there exists a modern arrogance that cannot countenance the idea that ancient civilisations might have been scientifically superior.
But it seems that Griaule, a scientist, wanted to attribute to earlier civilisations more knowledge than they actually possessed. Credulous scholars, like Young and Temple, were taken in and through them a whole generation has swallowed the false mythology of aliens from “the Dark Sirius Companion.”
En breve te pongo un video en donde entrevistan a los jefes de los dogon y refutan por completo lo que acabas de poner, digo, hay que ir a la fuente principal para investigar, no basarse en conclusiones que intentan dar explicaciones agarradas de los pelos a algo que unos brutos negros de África dijeron y que pone en peligro la superioridad blanca... Cómo los negros van a saber algo que los blancos no sabían? Pero qué herejía!
ciberjovi68 escribió:quiza sea el sida un virus creado por ellos?
En resumidas cuentas, lo de Sirio B y C ya se sabía en 1930, cosa que Temple y compañía niegan.
Pero parece que Griaule, un científico, ha querido atribuir a las anteriores civilizaciones más conocimiento de lo que realmente poseen. Crédulos estudiosos, al igual que Young y Temple, influenciaron a toda una generación que ha tragado con la falsa mitología de los extraterrestres de la obra "The Dark Sirius Companion".
Vale, espero el vídeo.
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